The Culture of Cafes

[Spokes]

In Europe there are cities where the main streets are a non-stop procession of restaurants and coffee shops. People linger on them to the point that the local coffee shop becomes part of your living space. When you want to relax or read a book you have now an extra choice: the living room, the bedroom or the coffee shop near by.

With the current suburban configuration we are a long way away from this but it works remarkably well.

But there's a significantly different lifestyle, a more relaxed one, in Europe where sitting around for hours at a time at a coffee shop. Unfortunately we don't seem to have that culture. Yet?

Noted this afternoon that A Second Look got their new sign up today. Very smart-looking, fits in well.

And looks awesome at night!

Also, the residences above have seen their terrible metal "railings" removed. Not sure if they'll be replaced with something that looks better or just do without them all together. I'd love to see a complete facade restoration there. (upper levels)

[IEFBR14]

There is literally a coffee shop every 10 shops, and you simply don't notice because the rest of the street is lined with other kinds of activity.

What does that say about Canada where it seems every other shop or kiosk in a mall sells cellphones?

But there's a significantly different lifestyle, a more relaxed one, in Europe where sitting around for hours at a time at a coffee shop.

It depends on the country. In the latin countries yes, and especially in smaller communities. But not so much in germanic countries, especially in the larger cities. And in all cases, there and here, these days the people you see spending the most amount of time "sitting around for hours at a coffee shop" aren't usually interacting with others nearby. They're interacting with their notebooks, smartphones or tablets

[Spokes]

It depends on the country. In the latin countries yes, and especially in smaller communities. But not so much in germanic countries, especially in the larger cities. And in all cases, there and here, these days the people you see spending the most amount of time "sitting around for hours at a coffee shop" aren't usually interacting with others nearby. They're interacting with their notebooks, smartphones or tablets

Really? While it was not as much as when I was in France, I definitely noticed this in Germany.

[panamaniac]

What does that say about Canada where it seems every other shop or kiosk in a mall sells cellphones?

It depends on the country. In the latin countries yes, and especially in smaller communities. But not so much in germanic countries, especially in the larger cities. And in all cases, there and here, these days the people you see spending the most amount of time "sitting around for hours at a coffee shop" aren't usually interacting with others nearby. They're interacting with their notebooks, smartphones or tablets

I accept the points made by others that the growing number of coffee shops/cafes Downtown may signal more improvements to come. Since we're a bit off topic already, I wanted to ask about your comment IEFBR14. I admit that I am a "pre-computer age" person (yes, some of us are still alive and kicking!) but I have long been puzzled by the fact that in many coffee places I visit, most of the young people are there, by themselves, with their faces buried in their computers. Not socializing or waiting for friends to show up, just out of the house without needing to interact with anyone. What's up with that, I really don't get it? Why are they out at all if their only engagement is going to be with the same computer they could be using at home? Even asking the question makes me think that society has moved on in some strange way and I have been left behind (you'll know me when you see me - I'll be the old geezer that sits beside you with his newspaper and freaks you out by asking you how your day is going!). My suggestion to the cafe owners would be to hold a "no electronic devices permitted day" once a week and see how the atmosphere in the place changes, but I am afraid the main result would be that many people would just refuse to go in!

[benjaminbach]

But there's a significantly different lifestyle, a more relaxed one, in Europe where sitting around for hours at a time at a coffee shop. Unfortunately we don't seem to have that culture. Yet?

Is a lifestyle of sitting around for hours at a time at a coffee shop really sustainable for a productive society?

Some of the countries we are talking about are beautiful, filled with great people & amazing culture, but don't exactly have the most productive (in the economic sense of the word) economies.

Nice while it lasts, but eventually the bill for a "relaxed" society comes due (look at Greece and the other PIIGS countries)

[BuildingScout]

But there's a significantly different lifestyle, a more relaxed one, in Europe where sitting around for hours at a time at a coffee shop. Unfortunately we don't seem to have that culture. Yet?

Instead we sit alone for hours at a time in front of a TV screen living vicariously watching "Friends".

[BuildingScout]

Some of the countries we are talking about are beautiful, filled with great people & amazing culture, but don't exactly have the most productive (in the economic sense of the word) economies.

The most productive workers in the world are, hang on to this, the French. Really, look it up.

[KLM]

The most productive workers in the world are, hang on to this, the French. Really, look it up.

with their 36 hours regular work week and even less.

Like Angela Merkel said: socialism is good while somebody else pays for it.( PIIGS)

[benjaminbach]

Instead we sit alone for hours at a time in front of a TV screen living vicariously watching "Friends".

I wasn't giving a ringing endorsement to my generation's work ethic either.

[IEFBR14]

Really? While it was not as much as when I was in France, I definitely noticed this in Germany.

I'm not sure which of my points you're reacting to. My experience, admittedly anecdotal and admittedly more in germanic than latin countries, is that in larger cities, both in coffee shops and elsewhere, there's more "hustle and bustle." The places are busy but it seems to me the turnover is also more rapid, especially by people in suits. Sure, you'll still see people lingering and chatting. I suspect they tend to be tourists, "housespouses", retirees, etc.

As for interacting with computerized devices, again anecdotal, Europeans seem to have caught up with us. They tend to favour smartphones. We tend to favour netbooks and notebooks. But I see increasing numbers of all such devices in coffee shops on both sides of the pond.

I am a "pre-computer age" person (yes, some of us are still alive and kicking!)

I'm more of the "created the computer age" demographic. Sorry about that

but I have long been puzzled by the fact that in many coffee places I visit, most of the young people are there, by themselves, with their faces buried in their computers.

My concern is that while they're visible in coffee shops, their faces continue to be buried in computers, phones, video games, etc. even when they're at more private locations like home, on campus, etc. This is a great topic for conversation but probably in another thread or maybe better still in person at a coffee shop or at Saturday's meet.

[garthdanlor]

Is a lifestyle of sitting around for hours at a time at a coffee shop really sustainable for a productive society?

Yes, how have these cultures (Italy, Greece, Spain, etc) managed to muddle through the millennia with their siestas, long lunches and dinners, etc.? Just think, if they would have actually applied themselves, they could have contributed something to society...

Some of the countries we are talking about are beautiful, filled with great people & amazing culture, but don't exactly have the most productive (in the economic sense of the word) economies.

Nice while it lasts, but eventually the bill for a "relaxed" society comes due (look at Greece and the other PIIGS countries)

The US is one of the most overworked, under-holidayed, and "productive" countries in the world, yet they are in pretty much the same situation (or worse) than these countries...lets toss in the UK here too as another example of a less than "relaxed" country that is in serious trouble.

[benjaminbach]

Yes, how have these cultures (Italy, Greece, Spain, etc) managed to muddle through the millennia with their siestas, long lunches and dinners, etc.? Just think, if they would have actually applied themselves, they could have contributed something to society...



The US is one of the most overworked, under-holidayed, and "productive" countries in the world, yet they are in pretty much the same situation (or worse) than these countries...lets toss in the UK here too as another example of a less than "relaxed" country that is in serious trouble.

All those countries have a problem, which can be oversimplified to: a) not enough production (manufacturing) and b) too much spending by central authorities.

Merkel's quote from a few posts back is true.

[garthdanlor]

All those countries have a problem, which can be oversimplified to: a) not enough production (manufacturing) and b) too much spending by central authorities.

Merkel's quote from a few posts back is true.

So probably not much to do with enjoying good discussion and long meals then....

[IEFBR14]

All those countries have a problem, which can be oversimplified to: a) not enough production (manufacturing) and b) too much spending by central authorities.

That's also consistent with my contention that contrary to popular belief, their national sport isn't soccer. It's tax evasion

But now I've really digressed...

[benjaminbach]

So probably not much to do with enjoying good discussion and long meals then....

Hey, I love good discussion with friends over a lazy dinner.

Generally speaking, having a lifestyle of 'spending hours at a cafe' usually doesn't go hand in hand with a society that is manufacturing based and working close to capacity.

[mpd618]

Generally speaking, having a lifestyle of 'spending hours at a cafe' usually doesn't go hand in hand with a society that is manufacturing based and working close to capacity.

How about a lifestyle of spending hours in front of a TV and hours stuck in traffic?

Productivity is not about avoiding the enjoyment of life, but about working hard when you are at work, and having the rest of your time being rejuvenating instead of draining.

[KLM]

Several reasons why people are not at cafe or socializing: long hours of work, long commute to work, stuck in traffic idling and even if somebody wants to he/she is so tired.Plus if you have kids ,you would probably devote your time to kids taking them to activities, not hanging out at cafe.
Even if you dont commute and lets say you work for some prominent hi-tech companies in Waterloo ,hardly there is time to go out during work week.

[CompassRose]

All those countries have a problem, which can be oversimplified to: a) not enough production (manufacturing) and b) too much spending by central authorities.

Merkel's quote from a few posts back is true.

Because production and manufacturing and growth are the truly fulfilling ways to build a HUMAN society. And hard work all day and corresponding rich financial rewards are the most important things going, even if you don't have time to hang out at cafes - or relax at all, if it comes to that, cos your weekends and off time are spent maintaining your Stuff.

On topic, many of the people at cafes with their faces buried in their computers are quite possibly working. The concept of the "mobile office" is taking off, and many people I know who are doing this kind of work like to get the heck out of their homes every now and then, so they go where the coffee is good and the wifi is flowing.

[mpd618]

On topic, many of the people at cafes with their faces buried in their computers are quite possibly working. The concept of the "mobile office" is taking off, and many people I know who are doing this kind of work like to get the heck out of their homes every now and then, so they go where the coffee is good and the wifi is flowing.

Another approach is to do the same thing with beer instead of coffee. From the website of the new McCabe's pub:

If you want to come in and enjoy a drink while completing some work feel free to bring your laptop as McCabe's has a built in wireless internet system.