Highway 7/8 Widening & Improvements | Fischer-Hallman Road to Courtland Avenue

[Duke-of-Waterloo]

The Federal and Provincial governments have committed $2.4 Million to "rehabilitate" Highway 7/8 between Fischer-Hallman Road and Courtland Avenue. This was announced on April 7, 2010 in the Infrastructure Stimulus Fund At Work In Ontario announcement.

See press release here. The commitment for Highway 7/8 is the 6th project on the Highway Infrastructure list.

[Urbanomicon]

Awesome. It's great to see this project will be starting soon. That section is jammed every rush hour.

[Duke-of-Waterloo]

Awesome. It's great to see this project will be starting soon. That section is jammed every rush hour.

I wouldn't be so sure. $2.4 Million is nowhere near the amount of money the MTO will need to widen the highway to modern standards. Just think of all the overpasses that will need to be expanded, new ramps, new lanes, new illumination, signage...etc. To be honest, I'm skeptical of the investment announced this week and what it will actually do. I think it would cost about $2.4 Million just to resurface the existing four lanes and ramps and maybe patch up a couple of crumbling bridges between the above study limits...[sigh]

[Urbanomicon]

Hmm. Good Point. Maybe this is just the payment for the first phase? I don't remember the details ofthis project. There was a bunch of stuff posted on SSP about it as well as some environmental assessments and costing information. If I remember correctly, they were going to re-do the Ottawa on-ramp as well.

I'll see if I can find the relevant information.

[Urbanomicon]

I found the relevant thread, but the links to the Waterloo Region website relating to that particular project seem to be broken.

[Duke-of-Waterloo]

Finally! An update on this stalled project!! This one is for you urbanomicon.

This ad for an upcoming Public Information Centre (PIC)on April 28th at the Concordia Club was in The Record today, on page B2. It looks as if the study area has been revised, and extended by roughly 1 km to the west of Fischer-Hallman Road.

http://www.therecord.com/pdfs/20100417/B02.pdf

[Urbanomicon]

Finally! An update on this stalled project!! This one is for you urbanomicon.

Great find Duke! Awesome to hear that this project hasn't died or become lost in the circular folder that is the government. I should be able to make the PIC. Hopefully they'll have some more information and better visuals.

[Spokes]

Better interchanges key to expressway expansion

April 23, 2010
Road Ahead column by Jeff Outhit

Ontario is still working on its overdue plans to widen the expressway in west Kitchener. But it has not set a start date for construction.

It’s important to widen Highway 7/8 between Fischer-Hallman Road and Courtland Avenue. The overwhelmed highway regularly backs up as commuters head to west Kitchener neighbourhoods.

The province announced $150 million in funding last year. Ministry of Transportation spokesperson Bob Nichols now says the construction launch is “subject to change based on funding, design, environmental approvals, property acquisition and construction requirements.” When work begins, it will take three years.

An open house is planned to solicit public input into the highway design. It’s on April 28 from 4 to 8 p.m. at the Concordia Club at 429 Ottawa St. S. in Kitchener.

The proposed expansion includes:

Widening from four to six lanes, plus the addition of a median barrier. There would be eight lanes between Courtland and Homer Watson Boulevard. This will ease bottlenecks and improve safety, by keeping out-of-control cars from sliding into oncoming traffic across the grassy median. Planners now intend to widen the road almost two kilometres west of Fischer-Hallman.

Remodelled interchanges at Courtland, Homer Watson Boulevard and Fischer-Hallman.

Better lighting and some new noise barriers, to better shield adjacent neighbourhoods.

All this makes sense. The biggest challenges are the non-standard interchanges, which are generally overwhelmed and rather awkwardly built.

Plans for the Fischer-Hallman interchange include the addition of an eastbound on-ramp. This would help ease the traffic mess near the Sunrise shopping centre.

At the Homer Watson interchange, local planners have proposed a second on-ramp to the eastbound expressway, at Alpine Road. If approved, it would ease pressure on the eastbound on-ramp at Ottawa Street. It’s overwhelmed, which contributes to headaches at Ottawa and Homer Watson.

Greenbrook Drive resident John Innanen has pitched connecting the dead end of Highland Road to the westbound off-ramp, just metres away. This would provide a smoother expressway exit for northbound vehicles. It would likely draw traffic from busy Greenbrook. However, it might increase Highland traffic, while also putting more trucks and cars past Queen Elizabeth Public School, next to the interchange. That’s a trade-off that may not win support.

There are no plans to connect the expressway to Westmount Road.

The last open house on expressway widening drew 47 people in 2006. A stronger turnout would be helpful as the project inches closer to its launch.

Jeff Outhit can be reached at 519-895-5642 or jouthit@therecord.com

"eight lanes between Courtland and Homer Watson" Is this really necessary? Im good with 6, but 8?

[Urbanomicon]

"eight lanes between Courtland and Homer Watson" Is this really necessary? Im good with 6, but 8?

There are currently 8 lanes immediately after the 8/85 junction. I imagine they are keeping them up to Homer Watson to eliminate the current problem of drivers exiting from the 8 having to move over two lanes (one ends and one exits at Courtland) in about 500 meters. Not only does this cause backlogs in traffic, but it is very dangerous and a number of accidents have occured in this area.

Additionally, the Courtland and Homer Watson exits are very close together (800m?) so the costs for these extra lanes is not huge (relative to the rest of the project).

Also, I would estimate about 1/3 of the traffic exits the highway at Homer Watson with relatively little traffic exiting at Courtland. I don't think it wouldn't make sense to end a lane at a relatively little-used offramp.

Just my two cents having driven that stretch many, many times.

[Spokes]

Ya I guess that's true. Maybe it would make sense.

[garthdanlor]

I wonder how many other cities of less than 350000 have their own 8 lane expressway, and still manage to jam it up during rush hour?

[Waterlooer]

I wonder how many other cities of less than 350000 have their own 8 lane expressway, and still manage to jam it up during rush hour?

Same, London has no expressways and its traffic is fine. I don't think anyone in London wants a highway, their population is about 350000 people I think.

[Urbanomicon]

I wonder how many other cities of less than 350000 have their own 8 lane expressway, and still manage to jam it up during rush hour?

Probably very few.

Since the majority of the traffic seems to be going to/from highway 8, I would guess that this stems from the fact that K-W only has three interchanges with the 401 (more like 2.5 really since the 8 only goes East for the time being). That is one interchange per 117,000 people if you're going East, or one interchange per 175,000 people if you're going West. How many other cities of 350,000 only have three interchanges with their nearby 400 series highway? How many require the use of these same 3 roads to get to their neighbouring city (Cambridge)? For comparison, Cambridge, a city of 120,000 people, has 4 interchanges or one per every 30,000 poeple.

[garthdanlor]

Probably very few.

Since the majority of the traffic seems to be going to/from highway 8, I would guess that this stems from the fact that K-W only has three interchanges with the 401 (more like 2.5 really since the 8 only goes East for the time being). That is one interchange per 117,000 people if you're going East, or one interchange per 175,000 people if you're going West. How many other cities of 350,000 only have three interchanges with their nearby 400 series highway? How many require the use of these same 3 roads to get to their neighbouring city (Cambridge)? For comparison, Cambridge, a city of 120,000 people, has 4 interchanges or one per every 30,000 poeple.

It would be interesting to see the actual breakdown of cross town traffic versus to/from 401 traffic. I'm sure the latter is in the majority.

Wonder how the link-up with the new Highway 7 will affect volume on the expressway? I would imagine that quite a few commuters continue to use the old 7, especially as it will have a lot less traffic.

[jay]

Cambridge may have more interchanges to the 401 but the traffic there is 10x worse then KW. I agree they need multiple ways to access the 401 from 8. If they had more I'm sure it would reduce traffic of people working in KW driving home to Cambridge or people leaving to goto London/Toronto.

Most of the backup on Highway 8 is due to incompetence, and adding more lanes to a highway doesn't always help.

[Urbanomicon]

Cambridge may have more interchanges to the 401 but the traffic there is 10x worse then KW.

It would be interesting to see how the traffic levels compare between the region's interchanges. Does the Provincial Government publish similar traffic studies to those of the region?

[Urban_Enthusiast86]

Cambridge may have more interchanges to the 401 but the traffic there is 10x worse then KW. I agree they need multiple ways to access the 401 from 8. If they had more I'm sure it would reduce traffic of people working in KW driving home to Cambridge or people leaving to goto London/Toronto.
Most of the backup on Highway 8 is due to incompetence, and adding more lanes to a highway doesn't always help.

Traffic is only worse in Cambridge for the 2 main north-south arterials, Hespeler and Franklin. Otherwise, there's little difference and KW would actually have busier roads in general.

Using this site...

http://www12.statcan.ca/english/cens...6=0&GID=520308

I've determined that, from 2001 statscan data (note, the numbers would be significantly higher in 2010):

- 10865 people commute from KW to Cambridge for work
- 7495 people commute from Cambridge to KW for work

However, it doesn't add up that traffic at the Kitchener/Cambridge border would be sooo much worse than at any point at the Kitchener-Waterloo border. The issue is, how many ways are there to travel between Kitchener and Cambridge? Because of the unique geography of that area and the fact that Cambridge hangs off the southeast tail of Kitchener, there are only 3 ways to get between the 2 cities, which are:

- Hwy 401 via hwy 8
- King street (Preston) via hwy 8
- Maple Grove Rd via hwy 8
- Hwy 401 or Fountain street via Homer Watson

There is also Fountain street through Breslau, but that is out of the way for most people's travel needs. The majority of this traffic crams onto hwy 8 to travel between Kitchener and Cambridge or to get to the 401 to go elsewhere (GTA, etc).

Compare that to the seamless border of Kitchener and Waterloo where you have...

- Conestoga Parkway
- Ira Needles
- Fischer Hallman
- Westmount
- Belmont
- King
- Weber
-Lancaster/Bridgeport
- and a whole bunch of residential streets

While the total traffic flow might be higher, the people travelling between the cities aren't largely moving down a single roadway.

[Urbanomicon]

- Hwy 401 via hwy 8
- King street (Preston) via hwy 8
- Maple Grove Rd via hwy 8
- Hwy 401 or Fountain street via Homer Watson

There is also Fountain street through Breslau, but that is out of the way for most people's travel needs. The majority of this traffic crams onto hwy 8 to travel between Kitchener and Cambridge or to get to the 401 to go elsewhere (GTA, etc).

There is also old King Street in Kitchener that runs along the same path as Highway 8; but since this is mainly a two-lane road, its traffic handling potential is limited.

[Urban_Enthusiast86]

There is also old King Street in Kitchener that runs along the same path as Highway 8; but since this is mainly a two-lane road, its traffic handling potential is limited.

Either way, you get how there is a funnelling effect of traffic in that area and why it has some of the worst traffic in the region.